{"id":3870,"date":"2017-05-01T10:10:25","date_gmt":"2017-05-01T17:10:25","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/bclaconnectrev.wpengine.com\/perspectives\/?p=3870"},"modified":"2025-01-22T11:26:33","modified_gmt":"2025-01-22T19:26:33","slug":"meharoona","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/bclaconnect.ca\/perspectives\/2017\/05\/01\/meharoona\/","title":{"rendered":"‘We have racism in Canada’: An interview with Community Engagement and Diversity Specialist Meharoona Ghani"},"content":{"rendered":"

[DIVERSITY]<\/strong><\/p>\n

Meharoona Ghani is the Manager of Community Connections and Diversity at the North Shore Multicultural Society. She is also the Principal of M. Ghani Consulting, Community Engagement and Diversity Specialist.<\/p>\n

This interview was conducted over the phone on April 5, and has been edited for brevity and clarity.<\/p>\n

\n

Cara Pryor:\u00a0<\/strong>I\u2019ve been thinking about when Trump was first elected and how much, I guess, smugness there was in Canada, imagining that we don\u2019t have the same kind of problems. We don\u2019t have a Trump. And then a few days later there was the attack on the mosque \u2013 which didn\u2019t stay in the news for very long. I wondered what you thought about that.<\/p>\n

Meharoona Ghani:<\/strong>\u00a0I remember a posting on Facebook, a comment that said, \u201coh be glad that we\u2019re in Canada and it\u2019s not like this in Canada.\u201d There were a couple of comments like that, and I didn\u2019t bother responding because social media is not the place to do it. I just looked at it as, in Canada, there are people out there who think that we\u2019re fine.<\/p>\n

To me it\u2019s not about which country people are in, it\u2019s about human beings who are uncomfortable in different situations and lash out in behaviour that is oppressive or racist. The situation in the US has caused those yahoos in Canada to resurface and do things like paint a swastika in Edgemont Village, or the shooting at the mosque. We have racism in Canada. It\u2019s been here all along and has never disappeared. I\u2019m not smug.<\/p>\n

The example of the mosque: the problem to look at is, why was that individual not called a terrorist, and what is the power of his whiteness<\/i>? How [has] the construct of white been created throughout history to position a certain group in power while keeping other people out of that power?<\/p>\n

We are all guilty. I\u2019m not saying we are all racist. I\u2019m saying we are all guilty of perpetuating ideas without even knowing we are doing it. We [need to] stop and look: What systems are in place? Are [we] aware of that history? [Are we] aware of ourselves?<\/p>\n

Cara:<\/strong>\u00a0There\u2019s sometimes a criticism that many people may see themselves as anti-racist, but do nothing. If we\u2019re all guilty, all complicit in these systems, what is required of us?<\/p>\n

Meharoona:\u00a0<\/strong>There is no general answer for everybody. It comes down to what is in your control and what isn\u2019t.<\/p>\n

There are people of colour who are also complacent. There are reasons for that too \u2013 there are some who want to be a part of the norm, a part of the mainstream, and not sure how to be vocal \u2013 because they might have experienced racism, or they don\u2019t want to stick out as a person of colour.<\/p>\n

Some white people might not be saying anything or doing anything because they\u2019re also afraid of sticking out or doing something wrong. So it becomes completely overwhelming for people.<\/p>\n

I think looking at what\u2019s doable, and within a person\u2019s control, is a way to help somebody deal with something. For example, if I was working in a library, I\u2019d review the books and literature to identify what\u2019s missing in terms of different types of issues and expand the collection. I\u2019d review our demographics and ensure those people are being served. That\u2019s one simple, do-able way.<\/p>\n

A white person could talk to a person of colour, and say, \u201cI\u2019ve noticed this is missing. What can we do together?\u201d Perhaps that person of colour might be looking for somebody to notice, to work with to bring it forward. Perhaps that person of colour might not be saying something out loud because they\u2019re not sure if they\u2019re going to rock the boat.<\/p>\n

It\u2019s relational. It\u2019s two people coming together and saying, \u201cWhat can we do?\u201d Find the courage to say it out loud.<\/p>\n

So it\u2019s breaking down, what the simplest thing a person can do that they have control over as a first step? And from there it can evolve to something bigger. And the next big step might be, what are we doing to make sure we have diverse staff? What does it mean to have diverse staff?<\/p>\n

Cara:<\/strong>\u00a0What does<\/i> it mean?<\/p>\n

Meharoona:<\/strong>\u00a0Well, it first means that the current staff needs to have training to understand what it means to have diverse staff. What is it they want? People are saying things like, \u201cWe want a diverse board.\u201d And I\u2019m saying, \u201cOkay, that\u2019s great, but what does that mean to you?\u201d<\/p>\n

A diverse board does not equal having every token checklist person there. It means people who have a very deep understanding about the systems of inequity that are in place that we need to change. [For instance], would the meeting time change to accommodate a person with a disability who needed to eat their meals and take their medication at a particular time?<\/p>\n

I don\u2019t believe organizations have thought through what diversity means, and how they\u2019re going to serve that need, other than having a checklist, thinking that it\u2019s just people of colour. Some people of colour are not even aware of what being diverse means.<\/p>\n

I don\u2019t want white people to feel that it\u2019s just them that need training. I feel every single person needs training. [Many people of colour don\u2019t necessarily] know anything about [their] own self-awareness, and the unconscious biases [they\u2019re] carrying. A man of colour might be just as sexist as a white man.<\/p>\n

And it\u2019s ongoing. As people, as organizations, as a society, we need to come to peace with the fact that we are never going to have [complete] belonging. We have to come to peace with the fact that we\u2019re constantly changing. So that means as we\u2019re constantly changing, we have to be constantly educated on those changes and [think about] how we\u2019re going to respond or react, or be proactive to change.<\/p>\n

And we\u2019re not always going to get it right. So that means, what are the spaces we are creating to make sure people can come forward in a safe way, in a respectful way, [and say], \u201cYou know, I\u2019m not sure about x,y, and z. What can we do?\u201d Belonging is always about being lost and found. And we go through that our entire life. The critical thing is:\u00a0How do we support each other when we go through those moments of lost and found?<\/p>\n

For me going through a process of lost and found was about letting go of what other people think. And so I am much more vocal than I ever used to be about the work I do in the diversity field. It has a lot to do with being told I have multiple sclerosis. My courage comes from that process of what I\u2019ve been through, this self-realization that, I don\u2019t know what my time on earth is going to be like. I might lose my vision, I might lose my ability to speak, I might lose my cognitive ability. I might lose so many things in my body.<\/p>\n

I made a choice that this is my life\u2019s purpose. So you make mistakes along the way. That\u2019s part of courage. That\u2019s part of lost and found.<\/p>\n

Cara:<\/strong>\u00a0How did this become your life\u2019s purpose?<\/p>\n

Meharoona:<\/strong>\u00a0When I was 8 years old I was first called racist names. That led me to fight racism. But at that time I never saw it as my life\u2019s purpose. Over time, I wanted to be a librarian [laughs], but diversity was always a part of that. I\u2019d be looking around and thinking, \u201cWhere are the books that I want to read? I\u2019m going to bring in the diversity lens.\u201d Then I got sidetracked with women\u2019s studies and race. I left government in 2011 and I was one of three women of colour in the entire country to lead a provincial multiculturalism and anti-racism file. After I left, I resisted and tried to get jobs that had nothing to do with diversity. My master\u2019s was in gender and international development and my thesis focused on violence against South Asian Muslim women. I was looking at community development, community participatory work. How do you bring community together to deal with issues? But the diversity thing kept on being put in my face, wherever I went \u2013 boom, boom. And finally I said to myself, maybe I\u2019m supposed to be listening to this. And then I knew, this is just my life\u2019s calling.<\/p>\n

Cara:\u00a0<\/strong>Before we go, I want to talk about the workshop you do. I personally felt profoundly affected by the hijab exercise that you took us through [where you begin the session wearing the hijab, and facilitate a discussion around our perceptions of your identity. Then you take the hijab off and facilitate a similar discussion]. What do you think it is that makes this\u00a0so effective?<\/p>\n

Meharoona:\u00a0<\/strong>There are two personal threads. [First], I was exploring wearing the hijab for myself. I did wear it at different times to see if I would wear it permanently, so I went through that journey.<\/p>\n

The other personal thread is that when I was in my twenties, the first Gulf War happened in Iraq, and I was in a Muslim association [in Victoria]. We were being invited by different communities to come and talk to different organizations about Muslims. People were afraid, and they didn\u2019t know anything about Islam. They wanted to learn about Muslim people.<\/p>\n

We got invited to Camosun College. I was in the audience. And there was this UVIC professor who converted from Catholicism to Islam. She was of white identity and was also part of the [Muslim Association]. She wore a hijab, which is a head scarf, and she also wore what\u2019s called a burqa, which is a long robe.<\/p>\n

Suddenly the audience started focusing on her clothes rather than the topic. There was an assumption starting to become apparent that she was being forced somehow to wear the clothing she wore. And then, in the slip of a second, she suddenly took her hijab off in front of the entire audience. She kept it off, and her hair \u2013 long, beautiful, auburn hair just fell to her waist. And she said, \u201cThis is my choice. This is a piece of cloth. It does not define who I am.\u201d<\/p>\n

Me and my sister and other young Muslim women silently cheered. We felt so proud. And that was the first time I felt proud to be Muslim.<\/p>\n

[So] when I was asked five years ago to be a keynote speaker at Corrections Canada – about diversity – I thought, what am I going to talk about? I reflected a lot on what [diversity] means to me, on a personal level.<\/p>\n

I also believe that part of transformational change comes from personal story. If we want to make change in other people, or if we want people to feel something around the importance of what we\u2019re doing, then we\u2019ve got to become vulnerable and share our personal story.<\/p>\n

Then I remembered that scenario at Camosun College, and I thought, \u201cOh! I\u2019m going to do that.\u201d Because I\u2019d tried wearing the hijab – I\u2019d wanted to see what it was like. So why don\u2019t I come in and do the whole scenario of wearing it and taking it off and see what happens? That was a ten-minute keynote and from there it has evolved into a two-hour workshop.<\/p>\n

Cara:<\/strong>\u00a0And it really did open up a space for people to say out loud their fears and their worries about what that meant, and who you were. It also provided a space to recognize internally, like, \u201cOooooohhh\u2026.I thought you were this person, and now I think you\u2019re this person. And this is what I\u2019m doing in the world.\u201d It was a really important tool to spark that inner exploration.<\/p>\n

Meharoona:<\/strong>\u00a0It shows, \u201cI\u2019m also a human being under all this clothing. I\u2019m just like you, whether I\u2019m wearing this or not, I\u2019m still you. Behind this, I\u2019m just like everybody else.\u201d<\/p>\n

\n

Find Meharoona online at:<\/p>\n